Comments on: Why I Hate List Rentals http://theemailwars.com/2008/12/19/why-i-hate-list-rentals/ Fri, 03 Sep 2010 15:57:57 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Shannon D. Denniston http://theemailwars.com/2008/12/19/why-i-hate-list-rentals/comment-page-1/#comment-1360 Shannon D. Denniston Tue, 30 Dec 2008 00:16:58 +0000 http://theemailwars.com/?p=1379#comment-1360 List rental is a BAD thing and a sure fire way to get your email/affiliate/ISP/ESP accounts terminated not to mention you open up the door to lawsuits, fines and other such things. Be smart, build your own list and let others do the same. It's soooo easy, why on earth would you want to risk both your personal and business reputation by mailing to a third party list? It's not going to make you rich overnight, the reality is it might just put you "out of business" overnight. ;-) Expect Success, Shannon D. Denniston, CEO Contact Buddy Email Marketing 859.498.4729 http://www.contactbuddy.com List rental is a BAD thing and a sure fire way to get your email/affiliate/ISP/ESP accounts terminated not to mention you open up the door to lawsuits, fines and other such things. Be smart, build your own list and let others do the same. It’s soooo easy, why on earth would you want to risk both your personal and business reputation by mailing to a third party list? It’s not going to make you rich overnight, the reality is it might just put you “out of business” overnight. ;-)

Expect Success,
Shannon D. Denniston, CEO
Contact Buddy Email Marketing
859.498.4729
http://www.contactbuddy.com

]]> By: dylan http://theemailwars.com/2008/12/19/why-i-hate-list-rentals/comment-page-1/#comment-1355 dylan Tue, 23 Dec 2008 17:59:52 +0000 http://theemailwars.com/?p=1379#comment-1355 DJ I know you agree but the fact is we all need to get out marketing teams to agree. Not eROI in this case as we do not do this, but there are some great ways to walk the talk. Our latest study drive 1000s of new leads, and our holiday card did the same. All in a good nice opt in way. DJ I know you agree but the fact is we all need to get out marketing teams to agree. Not eROI in this case as we do not do this, but there are some great ways to walk the talk.

Our latest study drive 1000s of new leads, and our holiday card did the same. All in a good nice opt in way.

]]> By: DJ Waldow http://theemailwars.com/2008/12/19/why-i-hate-list-rentals/comment-page-1/#comment-1354 DJ Waldow Tue, 23 Dec 2008 13:41:59 +0000 http://theemailwars.com/?p=1379#comment-1354 @Dylan: To your last point, "as ESPs lets not do list rental to acquire customers"...I agree with you 100%. dj at bronto @Dylan: To your last point, “as ESPs lets not do list rental to acquire customers”…I agree with you 100%.

dj at bronto

]]> By: dylan http://theemailwars.com/2008/12/19/why-i-hate-list-rentals/comment-page-1/#comment-1351 dylan Mon, 22 Dec 2008 16:53:10 +0000 http://theemailwars.com/?p=1379#comment-1351 So to clarify I hate list rentals for the above reasons. I do not think that as a whole that they do not work with expectations are set, lists are clean and permission only, and creative and landing pages have been built for a rental campaign. (The creative has to be spot on, on point and tested thoroughly.). They do work, but often times they carry more risk than reward. I would only have examples of bad ESP list rental campaigns gone wrong as in my opinion if I get them @eROI then they did not do a good job on suppressing the list. End of story. There is this one ESP in the south I have seen from for but I doubt that they perform as the creative is weak. Just this point, as ESPs lets not do list rental to acquire customers. Seems wrong to me in so many ways as a group that is trying to take everyone's practices higher. So to clarify I hate list rentals for the above reasons. I do not think that as a whole that they do not work with expectations are set, lists are clean and permission only, and creative and landing pages have been built for a rental campaign. (The creative has to be spot on, on point and tested thoroughly.).

They do work, but often times they carry more risk than reward.

I would only have examples of bad ESP list rental campaigns gone wrong as in my opinion if I get them @eROI then they did not do a good job on suppressing the list. End of story. There is this one ESP in the south I have seen from for but I doubt that they perform as the creative is weak.

Just this point, as ESPs lets not do list rental to acquire customers. Seems wrong to me in so many ways as a group that is trying to take everyone’s practices higher.

]]> By: DJ Waldow http://theemailwars.com/2008/12/19/why-i-hate-list-rentals/comment-page-1/#comment-1350 DJ Waldow Mon, 22 Dec 2008 14:41:37 +0000 http://theemailwars.com/?p=1379#comment-1350 @Dylan: Very interesting post. While I agree with all 4 of your points, I am a bit confused as I could have sworn that we've had conversations in which you said you were a fan of list rental. Maybe I am confusing that "discussion" with the many other debates we've had in the past. Either way...glad to see that you and I are on the same page on this one. I think that - in general - the list rental practice is a bad one...for all 4 reasons you detail above. However, like anything else in email marketing, there are good ways to do it and bad. There is CAN-SPAM and there is best practice. Even within best practice, there are bad, good, and better ways to rent lists. Looking at your last example (above), I would say this falls into the notsogood category of list rental. Do you have any examples of a list rental campaign that a company (or maybe even an ESP) has done that has returned fantastic results? This is not an area that I specialize in, but I have to believe that companies have seen success in list rentals or they wouldn't still be executing them, right? I'd add #5 to your list of 4 above: Lost control. When you allow someone else to send an email out on your behalf (i.e., with your content), you are taking a potentially enormous risk. What if they don't include an opt-out? What if they send through bad IPs? What if the copy they send is not the same as that which you approved? In my opinion...these risks also (may) outweigh the gains. Let the discussion begin. Who else is ready to jump in? dj at bronto @Dylan: Very interesting post. While I agree with all 4 of your points, I am a bit confused as I could have sworn that we’ve had conversations in which you said you were a fan of list rental. Maybe I am confusing that “discussion” with the many other debates we’ve had in the past. Either way…glad to see that you and I are on the same page on this one.

I think that – in general – the list rental practice is a bad one…for all 4 reasons you detail above. However, like anything else in email marketing, there are good ways to do it and bad. There is CAN-SPAM and there is best practice. Even within best practice, there are bad, good, and better ways to rent lists.

Looking at your last example (above), I would say this falls into the notsogood category of list rental.

Do you have any examples of a list rental campaign that a company (or maybe even an ESP) has done that has returned fantastic results? This is not an area that I specialize in, but I have to believe that companies have seen success in list rentals or they wouldn’t still be executing them, right?

I’d add #5 to your list of 4 above: Lost control. When you allow someone else to send an email out on your behalf (i.e., with your content), you are taking a potentially enormous risk. What if they don’t include an opt-out? What if they send through bad IPs? What if the copy they send is not the same as that which you approved? In my opinion…these risks also (may) outweigh the gains.

Let the discussion begin. Who else is ready to jump in?

dj at bronto

]]> By: Paul Broni http://theemailwars.com/2008/12/19/why-i-hate-list-rentals/comment-page-1/#comment-1349 Paul Broni Mon, 22 Dec 2008 12:44:09 +0000 http://theemailwars.com/?p=1379#comment-1349 On the VerticalResponse mailing, it's possible that the mailing came from an affiliate, isn't it? Having said that, I would agree that the company should find the affiliate and terminate their agreement (if that's what happened). On the VerticalResponse mailing, it’s possible that the mailing came from an affiliate, isn’t it?

Having said that, I would agree that the company should find the affiliate and terminate their agreement (if that’s what happened).

]]> By: Anna Billstrom http://theemailwars.com/2008/12/19/why-i-hate-list-rentals/comment-page-1/#comment-1347 Anna Billstrom Sat, 20 Dec 2008 00:32:48 +0000 http://theemailwars.com/?p=1379#comment-1347 great points, Dylan. I also dislike list rentals, and you articulated it quite well. great points, Dylan. I also dislike list rentals, and you articulated it quite well.

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